Hi. Long time reader, first time poster.

I found this in a fitness forum.

A guy, 22, wants to have sex with a girl who's 16. I'm the dad of a 1 year old daughter. I am worried about her enough as it is, but I cant think of how much I'd worry about this if this was my daughter. I'm angry about this guy doing this, am I right to be angry? What would you do if your daughter was in this situation?

(to make things equal, you can read the 22 year old guys side on his blog, http://www.becomingapua.com/2007/09/06/hav...-a-16-year-old/ )

huh, I never really 'got' statuatory rape. I mean like if two people wanna bang is that such a bad thing? hell, my classmates have been having sex since sixth or seventh grade but heaven forbid they bang someone too old. . .

edit: SHIT, I just gave my 200th post to a n00b

You're right to be jealous.

She's legal and she wanted it from what I can gather. It's up to her. Depends on the conditions really, but here there isn't an enormous amount to be upset about.

The lines of legal and moral sexual discretion concerning age cross each other a lot. One might not find it objectionable for him to seek someone 18 simply because they are of legal age (were this in the US rather than Ontario), when that girl may be of the same mental and emotional development as a 16 year old. I would not find it distasteful for this man to meet a 16 year old girl, develop a meaningful relationship, and then want to consummate it. It would be more respectful of the law, if not her requisite maturity, to wait a couple years... but not outright necessary.

That said, if this man is only interested in sex and is posting on a fitness forum about trying to get it with an underage girl, I don't think he's actually going to have much luck anyway. I would consider his mindless pursuit of casual sex to be unappealing regardless of the ages in question.

---

After reading the 'article', he sounds like a real fool. I imagine there are a lot of guys like this realistically speaking. To answer your questions, I think we can both be angry in principle about the way he acts, but I don't think you or any other fathers have anything to worry about from his kind if you raise good and sensible daughters.

When in doubt: xkcd cites the standard 'creepiness rule' of X/2 + 7, so a 22 year old shouldn't be dating anyone younger than 18. And we all know xkcd is truth.

Must agree here. I'd be angry that the guy's an idiot, but I'd be even more angry that my daughter was an idiot for agreeing to have sex with this guy. But, as rooster says, if you raise your daughter correctly and teach her to steer clear of these losers, then you have nothing to worry about. Even from your short post, you sound like a good, caring father, and I think it will turn out fine.

Dude, if you get someone busted for statutory rape and make a big deal out of it for the media, you could get a book deal, which may very well lead to a movie deal. What father would pass up that opportunity?

"No."

Two hundred years ago, she could be popping out his kids and nobody'd blink. Sliding morality is shit.

Oh, you beat me to it.

It's not that big of a deal. 7 years difference...hah..
I've done 14 years difference (me being the younger one)
I'm almost 20 and I've seen a few 14 year olds that I would shag.

I'm not ashamed to say it..if you're hot, then you're hot, whether you're 14 or 42...
some chicks prefer older or young men, some guys prefer older or younger chicks.

i concur. i don't approve of casual sex on general principle, but that has nothing to do with age differences.* i thought it a bit lame (and perhaps immature on his part) when i read the article and found out he was only trying to pick up girls for sex, but if he was in a serious relationship with her and wanted to go that extra step, that's fine with me.

speaking from personal experience, age hasn't stopped me yet and it sure as hell isn't going to stop me now. ^_~

*that said, the age of consent is 14 where i live, which i think is a bit young whether it's casual or not and regardless of how old the other person is- but i wouldn't trust most of today's 14-year-olds to do their homework without prodding, let alone have sex responsibly.

As long as it's legal and consenting, I don't see anything wrong with it. I'm 23 and I dated a 17 year old this year (she asked me out, actually), though we didn't have sex. My dad is almost 14 years older than my mom.

*shrugs*

Reading the article, they guy doesn't seem entirely comfortable with the idea either. As for ages of consent, they're pretty much random, so, I dunno. I'm kinda gonna have to side with mWalk here as far as pure attraction goes, you can't turn it on or off, it's been hardwired over millions of years. And self control is highly unreliable in many instances with many people.

Well... your mom is pretty hot.

Concerned? Maybe.

Angry? No.

I was talking about when in a real relationship. Not just acting like a complete whore...by the way.

32/26? 42/36? 52/46?

don't see an issue, other than legality.

Your own self-control is completely reliable if you are determined to make it so. Unless you're talking about expecting self-control from every other person in society, which is indeed impossible.

Heh.

I see no problem with a 16 year old having sex with anyone of any age.

-Pufer

Old enough to pee is good enough for me.

Don't.
Just because he's new doesn't necessarily make him a n00b, it's only his first post and he hasn't proven himself either way yet.
His post was a lot better than many of yours have been.


Er...when you say that do you mean toilet trained? 'Cause newborns are old enough to pee.

Oh, he knows.

He knows.

Welcome.

Why be angry? Save it for when your daughter starts dating behind your back.

Is a 16 year old emotionally and intellectually mature enough to make the decision to be in a sexual relationship? I mean, they can't even vote at that age, and are barely able to drive. How can they be expected to make wise decisions like whether or not to have sex, or with whom.

Edit: that was a general statement, not directed toward EVERY 16 year old.


Keep talking like that, mister, and next time you'll get yerself outa jail.

No.

My hypothetical daughter would not be in that situation, so it would not even come up.



Ironyâ„¢



She'd probably have a couple already, or well on her way.

Yeah, I have to agree with you. When I voted no, I did so because it's really none of Dewayne2's business what some other people are doing. It's one thing to be worried about your own daughter, but angry about strangers on the internet? That's just silly. But having read your post and thinking about it, you're absolutely right. We've gotten so protective of our children, it's become almost a vicious cycle. First kids can't get married or work, next it's teenagers, next it's what?

From now on, I am of the belief that if your biology says you're ready for sex (first period, or first capability for ejaculation), then you are mature enough to make decisions about your reproductive activities (even if they don't lead to reproduction, or reproduction is otherwise prevented). Say what you will for mental maturity in teenagers, but who's to say what age one really becomes mature? Do we ever ? In any case, it's nothing that can be generalized about.

I know for a fact that there are 14 year olds out there with more life experience than I will have by the time I'm 24. It's just a matter of what life demands of us. I know that I'm not ready to settle down and have a kid (I'd take care of one just fine if it happened, but it wouldn't be ideal for anybody). Does that mean that I shouldn't be having sex? Should the government take my example and say that people my age aren't legally able to consent? I don't think anybody here would argue that 22 year olds aren't mature enough to give consent and yet how many 22 year olds aren't acting so responsibly with their bodies? If a 16 year old or a 13 year old is capable of the responsibility, and can make an informed choice about their body, nobody should be telling them they can't do what biology already says they can.

I'd say case-by-case basis is the only thing that works, with a close look at physical maturity as an indicator. If you don't want your kid having sex, be a parent and pass on your values early and often, but don't have the government imposing blanket rules about ages of consent and statutory rape. If anything, puberty is coming sooner for kids these days. We shouldn't be moving the age of consent in the opposite direction. All it means is that we're spending resources and time locking away consenting adults instead of going after actual child molesters. You know, the folks that scar people for life instead of making people happy.

Add me to the “no” crowd. As someone who happens to be 22 at the moment, personally I’m not expecting to come across any sixteen-year-old girls that appeal to me (even if only because they aren’t allowed in pubs and there aren't any at university - but there's also no way I'd get along with their friends, etc etc), but like others have said, it'd be a case-by-case thing in theory. I DID come across one late last year, and tossed and turned in bed about it for a week...

You know really, Dewayne2 should probably be more worried about what his daughter's hot girlfriends will look like in 15 years .

You hope. As would I. But despite the best foundation you can give/teach your kids, they will still make some hinky choices.

Wait! I'm not ready to take the handcuffs off!

Wifey makes a good point.

Most teenagers are driven by urges, doesn't matter what they've been taught. If they have a strong enough urge to screw a man 10 years older then they are, they'll go for it.

Well sure, and ultimately if it's consensual and a good experience I'm not going to get enraged and kill the guy. Honestly I probably wouldn't even find out. Can anybody here 16 years old or older say they tell their parents everything going on in their private life? Exactly.

Ultimately it does come down to hope, but it also does mean taking an interest in what your children are doing. If my daughter, or even my son for that matter was hanging out with a person outside the xkcd creepiness barrier. I would be the kind of parent to ask some questions and get real answers, and if I didn't like the answers I'd take that opportunity to remind my child about the sorts of values I had taught them, and would council them that people closer to their own age would make for a more meaningful experience. I would do this in a way that shows I respect their individuality and maturity, which again comes back to the fact that 16 year olds are more mature for the most part than they are usually given credit for. My parents treated me with respect and I returned it. Ultimately my views differ from theirs on more than a few things, and of course there were fights, etc. etc., the usual teenage stuff. But since I was able to differentiate myself from my parents without going crazy, I asserted the usual teenage individualism without going, well, crazy. You treat a kid like a kid, they will certainly act like a kid. You treat a young adult like a young adult, they'll act like a young adult. Age of consent laws just treat young adults like kids. They can be responsible, if that's what you show that you expect from them. Psychological and sociological studies back me up, why doesn't the law?

If any of my kids have sex with adults as teenagers with their full consent, it'll be because they care about the person and the person cares about them, not because they're rebelling. I can live with that. It wouldn't be my first choice for them, but after a certain point it's their life to live, even if that means making mistakes (or making good decisions too). But really, I do honestly believe that any kids I have would not make that kind of choice. The typical parent is so keyed up about forcing their kid into sports or college or whatever, and treats their kid like they can't be responsible for themselves, that the kid feels they have no choices except in their social life. So you're a teenager that needs to reject the values of their parents (for their own good mental health), and the only way to do that is the sorts of behaviors older people frown on.

So, just to reiterate since this post is longer than I intended and a lot of people probably just skimmed to the end, if you expect your kid to make bad decisions, they absolutely will. I'm not going to expect the worst from my kids. Heck, they're my kids. My kids will take over this silly planet and subjugate the entire galaxy. You know, unless they wanna just do art or become engineers or something... as long as they're happy. But that's why I want more than a few of them, so that at least one will want to subjugate the galaxy and ensure my genetic line for many generations.



By the way, great first topic, Dewayne2. I hope you post more in the future .

Nothing wrong with his being 22 and her being 16, but the guy seems like a bit sleazy from his blog. If I was her parent, I wouldn't care about the age difference, I'd care about my daughter's taste in men.

Yeah, the guy was just interested in hooking up with somebody, I don't think he was specifically cruising for 16 year olds. And he was initially put off by their ages. It was only later that he decided he'd actually pursue it, considering that she was actually legal and seemed interested.

Honestly though, what's the worst that could happen? Her heart is broken? Maybe an STD? Somebody her own age could break her heart too or give her a disease, that's just the reality of the situation. Are we worried here about underage people having sex, or underage people having consensual sex with older people? I'd probably say that most people who make these laws are thinking of the former, not the latter.

I think every human's most important right is the right to make their own mistakes. How else do we learn? You can't protect people forever, nor should you.

pfft, you want me to start listing everything that could happen two hundred years ago and nobody'd blink?



No, I don't think someone that age is capable of understanding the ramifications or consquences of their actions. yes, I think it's too young to be sexually active. Hell, she isn't even emancipated yet.

That being said, if she wants to, and he wants to, I don't think there is much we can or should be able to do about it.

no reason to be angry, but in my opinion the girl is dumb and the dude is pathetic.

I'd go with "Concerned" here, mostly.

Why lie? If you saw a particularly attractive woman, you'd probably be stimulated. It's genetics. Propagation of the species. Etc.

If you find out she's 16, then culturally it's probably not so great. However, we males are genetically coded to find genetically positive stuff (wide hips, breasts) attractive because it means "easy birth and good feeding the babies" on a subconscious level.

But yes, if she was 18 and he was 24, there would be no issue here whatsoever. Funny how that works. 720 days.

As an aside, yes, the blog poster in question is shallow, pathetic individual. When you have a relationship, you leave a piece of your soul with the other person. Do it too much and you don't have much soul left...

Next time? He's been in jail before? I see the smile but does that mean some will help him or that he's never been in jail?

Suppose it was a 16 year old guy having sex with a 22 year old woman, or older. The quintessential pupil-teacher relationship, for example. I bet most of the yes votes wouldn't even blink. Double standards are fun, eh?

I think its perfectly fine, and statutory rape is for a large part bullshit. (There are boundries that shouldn't be crossed, but the ages they chose are so arbitrary, and the fact that they are different in different states, for example, just proves they were pulled out of some lawmakers ass).

And damn, I wish I could do that.

Anger is good. You should probably resolve these issues you have with this 22 year old man by finding out where he lives.

Furthermore, it's just sex. I mean, come on.

I want to statutorily rape Hamster, but I don't think I legally can anymore

There was a topic about that very thing not too long ago. And yep, like 90% voted yes.

Yeah. You can't say that a male teenager is mature enough and a female isn't. Especially since it's usually the females that hit puberty first .

Heh.

In principle, I would have no problem with that age difference. If the age of consent in the US is 18, then there's a legal problem - but the legal age is 16 here in the UK anyway.

If the 22 year old guy is trying to take advantage of an emotionally immature 16 year old girl for cheap thrills, then I can see a moral problem there. But the age difference itself doesn't make it one, for me.

I couldn't stand to listen to most 16 year old girls long enough for sex.

The scenario you're talking about is entirely legal here in the UK, so for me it's a non-issue. Doubly so, given that I'm part of the 'abstinence before marriage' cabal. You do realise though, that you're playing directly into the cultural stereotype of over-protective dad. Your daughter is 1. If you're already worrying about issues that she may or may not have to worry about in 15 years time, I fear for your sanity, and her relationship with you during these intervening years.

If you're looking for healthy input; you're not going to be able to protect your daughter from every Tom, Dick *cough* or Harry forever. All you can do is instil in her solid, sound values, so that when she's faced with these things, she'll make good decisions.

You're talking about two people, who have nothing to do with you and who want to do something completely legal, and have both chosen to do so. In my opinion it's not my place, or yours, to label them as 'right' or 'wrong'. It's just not got anything to do with you. If anything, the guy wants you to scream and shout, and be labeled as wrong. I'd bet good money the same goes for the girl as well.

They're not hurting you, right now they're not hurting each other. Sure, the girl could get hurt, but so could the guy. I love how everyone is saying he's in the wrong, what's to say the girl isn't going to mess him around, and take advantage of him, why does he have to be the bad guy?

They're both taking risks, but are doing so in a sound state of mind, and by their own choice. That's the bottom line, anything else is just your personal opinion, and that is just that, yours.

Heh, that probably did need to be said.

erroneous postage